A.) "Sure. But only after I've ripped the
site, handed it out to lulzcunts, and gotten my street cred from all 5
of the people who appreciate it."
B.) "Sure. But only after I whank to this picture and then complain
about how the art sucks, so as to get street cred from 5 lulzcunts."
C.) "What good are you? I got you for free already on the google."
What works for people who want to be
stolen from and what works for people who don't want to be stolen from
are completely different things. Once again you fail to grasp the macro
due to a flawed fundamental philosophic viewpoint. If you want to
support the artists you like, then support them. If you don't want to
support the artists you don't like, why do you wish to cause them harm?
Because you think they are an ass? What kind of gradeschool reasoning is
that? The excuse of "oh, they don't feel it because we're only taking
from them a little bit" morality that you preach is dangerous.
Are you trying to teach me some kind of "lesson"? What, pray tell, might
that be? That if I give you everything for free, you will cease to
terrorize me? Where, then, is my incentive to create? For YOUR approval
and appeasement?
Who is the ass?
You know, I've been wanting to openly
debate you on this general subject for the longest damn time, and I'm
not going to waste this shot. So, let's take the gloves off, shall we?
What works for people who want to be
stolen from and what works for people who don't want to be stolen from
are completely different things.
You think of piracy as "theft", which is where your specific viewpoint
takes a left turn into "wrong". Piracy isn't theft; theft takes the
original product. while piracy simply makes a copy of the original
product. This isn't a justification of piracy, but an explanation.
Someone saving a SexyFur image and putting it on whatever imageboard
still accepts SexyFur images (because you've got most of them scared to
even mention your name) is piracy; someone finding the actual physical
SexyFur servers and yanking them out of their storage area is theft.
Before you think of continuing this debate, I ask you to at least learn
the difference, even if it is just semantics; I think it's important to
understand this difference and what it means.
If you want to support the artists you
like, then support them. If you don't want to support the artists you
don't like, why do you wish to cause them harm?
First: prove that piracy has specifically harmed your ability to do
business. I'm not talking about some sort of vague "I've lost
subscribers due to piracy!" whining or anything like that, I'm talking
about legitimate quantifiable statements that can be backed up with
evidence. In the periods where SexyFur piracy was the highest, how much
business were you doing in comparison to when SexyFur content was
barely pirated at all? Has SexyFur ever been on the verge of
bankruptcy? Has piracy ever cost you the opportunity to expand/improve
upon SexyFur? If piracy affects your ability to do business so badly,
then how were you able to open Tailheat?
Second: for the most part, piracy isn't about harming the artists (there
are some people who do it specifically out of spite, but they're
bastards and can't be changed, so fuck them). People want to share
information, whether that information is a pinup-style image of a naked
anthropomorphic rabbit woman or a two-and-a-half hour film epic like Avatar; piracy and filesharing has simply
made sharing that information easier than any other period in the
history of mankind. And don't think that just because people pirate a
work means that they don't want to support the people who made it - I
pirated The Dark Knight just weeks before
I picked up the DVD and after
having seen it in theaters three times a few months prior because I
wanted to see the movie again. Some people cannot afford the content,
or would not be able to obtain it without illicit/illegal filesharing;
in these cases, it would not be a stretch to believe that should those
people ever have the means, they would support the people behind the
works. (I would buy a subscription to ClubStripes if I could, despite
having their new works being posted to my board regularly - with their
permission, mind you - because I enjoy the content from their site and
they're not exceedingly uptight about people sharing their
works...unlike some other artists who shall remain nameless.)
The excuse of "oh, they don't feel it
because we're only taking from them a little bit" morality that you
preach is dangerous.
I don't preach that at all, and I don't appreciate having opinions
associated with me that I don't hold. So back the hate train up, and
let me explain my position.
Digital piracy, aka "copyright infringement", is technically illegal,
yes. I don't dispute this, nor will I ever try. But to imply that
digital piracy is wholly responsible for taking away the incentive to
create new works - which, if you'll note the appropriate sections of the
Constitution and United States copyright laws, is the intended purpose
of copyright - is ridiculous, as is claiming that digital piracy
prevents anyone from creating a work that can make a profit. The main
enemy of an artist isn't piracy, it's obscurity; if nobody's ever heard
of you or seen/heard your content, then that's going to do more harm to
your business model than any amount of piracy ever will.
Onta, admin/lead artist of Hardblush, engages fans regularly via FA,
Twitter, and the blog on Hardblush.
The main Clubstripes artists talk with fans on FA and DA, offer new
content outside of the site, and Midori even allows the site's new
content to be seen on my site.
Both Midori and Onta have posted on imageboards in the past as well,
including my site; Eric Schwartz even posts every once in a while on my
site, and he allows FurAfterDark content to be shared there to boot.
What have you done lately to connect with the fans of your site, or to
try and make new fans? Have you ever posted on an imageboard and openly
engaged both your fans AND your haters? Have you ever tried to
interact with other furries without the aid of lawyer or a DMCA threat?
Have you ever just tried being...I don't know, a little more human?
You have a certain reputation in the furry community, Bernal. That
reputation carries over to your works. If you want that reputation to
improve - and possibly get some new business in the process - maybe you
oughta try and pull that gigantic stick out of your ass.
That if I give you everything for free,
you will cease to terrorize me? Where, then, is my incentive to create?
Who's terrorizing you? I've never called for people to attack you, I've
never called for people to pirate your site's content, and I've never
asked anyone to do anything to you at all. (Mainly because I don't feel
like having you jump up my ass with a lawsuit threat for even
mentioning your name; I know you don't do it all the time, but you DO
have the reputation of being overly litigious and threatening, and if
you're not going to do anything to change that reputation, then far be
it from me to do it for you.) And giving "everything" away may not be
the best decision for your specific business model, while it may work
for someone else's (I point to Nine Inch Nails' Ghosts I–IV as proof in that regard).
But a little piracy here and there can't hurt. I've personally seen
posts on Lulz.net and my site from people saying that they subscribed to
ClubStripes after having seen the site's content prior to their
subscription purchase; in this case, piracy actually helped ClubStripes
gain business. As I said above: obscurity, not piracy, is an artist's
worst enemy.
As far as your incentive to create, it doesn't matter. People create
works every day that will likely never be seen by a large audience, or
become profitable, or anything like that - yet they still create. So if
you're doing it just for the money, and you're not making as much money
as you'd like, maybe that's a business model and/or reputation issue
that you should be looking into. If your work is too expensive, or
people see you as an asshole, or both,
then they're going to be a lot less likely to buy from you. If that
turns them to piracy, then who's fault is that?
It ain't mine, despite what you'd probably want me to believe.
But you know what? I think I'd like to toss you a challenge - a way to
quantifiably prove that piracy isn't as much of a problem as you think
it is.
As I've mentioned, ClubStripes allows their new content on my site on a
regular basis - in fact, they let us have a monthly thread dedicated to
their newest content, and after the end of the month, the thread gets
deleted to make way for the next month's thread (and we usually don't
get reposts of the previous month's content). We also disallow siterips
and mass posting of content (even ClubStripes doesn't want the whole
site given away).
So how about we offer you the same deal for one specific month? From
the beginning to the end of the month, you or a representative of the
site posts brand-spanking-new content from either SexyFur or Tailheat
(or both, if you prefer); you can either post it all, or just a single
pic from an update, or whatever you feel comfortable with. I'll
personally guarantee to moderate the thread to ensure that no siterips
or past content gets posted, or that nobody else posts content from
those sites, so that the thread is concentrated ONLY on the new content,
and I'll even throw out links to both sites in the opening post
regardless of what content you choose to post. At the end of the month,
I'll delete the thread, and then a month later, you can provide me with
any pertinent information in regards to your subscriber base in regards
to the three month period entailing the month prior to the thread, the
month the thread was up, and the month after the thread came down, to
see if the open sharing of SexyFur's/Tailheat's content had any real
effect on your business.
Of course, if you're not willing to do it...well, I'm not going to press
the issue. But this would be your opportunity to shut me up once and
for all, and it's something a lot of others would likely love to see you
do.
I would appreciate it if this debate be
brought somewhere else please.
If you want a discussion with Bernal on the subject, send him a private
message instead.
Thank you.
I would love to, except Bernal has this
nasty habit of blocking comments from people who disagree with him, and
I'm on his blocklist because I've called him out on being whiny about
piracy before, so...yeah.
Still, if he wants to send me one, he's more than welcome to. Or an
e-mail, if he prefers; my contact info isn't hard to find. Or hell, he
can even come to my board and debate me there (fat chance, but hey, the
invitation is open).
Last time I tried to comment on your page,
I was on your blocklist.
Also, I see you dodged the entirety of my comment. Feel free to send me
a note, though.
Or an e-mail.
Or post on my board. Open invitation, you won't be banned by any of the
mods, and hell, I'll even set up a custom tripcode for you if you want
(just so people will know it's you and not someone trolling with the
board).
Of course, if you don't have the balls, I understand. Most assholes
don't. :3
Hey dude, welcome to the electronic age.
You can either adapt your business model to take advantage of how well
information can spread on the internet, or you can die out. Also,
considering that your second in command had been caught tracing a photo,
I doubt you are in any position to whine about piracy. At least not
being taken seriously in doing so, hehe.
First off, you're the ass. You're
condescending, rude, and have your head so far up your own hind end your
eyebrows are tickling your tonsils.
Second, I used to be one of your subscribers, before your subscription
fee got ridiculously expensive, before you became a massive douchebag. I
understand the need to protect yourself from piracy, I do. But there's
ways of going about it, and when you act like a gigantic jackass, not
only are you going to have people rip your stuff just because they don't
want to pay for it, you're going to have people rip your stuff just to
spite you. To paraphrase Princess Leia "The more you tighten your grip,
the more star systems will slip through your fingers."
You know, there's some game engine out
there built to handle visual novels. Something I plan on noodling with
when my schedule clears up later in the year, if I can afford an artist.
evilartnazi
